Gordon PatersonWhy, Michael, is there such revulsion on the prospects of re-birth, when previous lives, as a reality, is questionable and improbable?
Why should one who is leading a compassionate life be concerned with the prospects of a future one? Who is there really to care? Shanti. Nirguna
Jeff CannonTo be right minded and right-action oriented solely based on the prospect of not having to return to the human experience seems counter-intuitive to the whole idea of samsara. If you are seeking a return on your investment of doing good, then you may be missing the entire point of doing good for the sake of simply being a better person, a better spirit and adding to the positive nature of existence.
Michael BelovedJeff, sure one is better off not aspiring for returns but that does nothing to deal with nature's way of rendering returns. It is not all up to the individual. If I shoot someone and he forgives me, I may still be faced by charges from the government. Both factors need be taken into account. The return from the courts will come even if the victim forgives and forgets. How to deal with that.
Michael BelovedGordon, I agree that once one denies his and everyone's individuality, there is no conversation. But here individuality is not denied but is recognized, as per Bhagavad Gita, where Krishna affirms that once it comes into existence it remains perpetual.
Gordon PatersonYes, of course, Michael, I will not question the Bhagavad Gita. Yet, the teaching of such masters as Sri Maharshi and Sri Nisargadatta, both Jnanis, instructs that the so-called individual, as an entity, is non-existent.
I'm not asking you to support these teachings, Michael, as you appear to be a profound Yogi, but Truth is singular and not-two and should be the same irrespective of the path leading to It. So the Goal, which is Self-knowledge, should be the same for all.
You are admired by This, Michael. Namaskaram. Nirguna
Michael BelovedGordon, The social self is definitely ephemeral even though functionally we must all pretend that it is real. Even to use the internet to communicate, one has to posture an identity to establish an account. To even eat one has to use some identity as this or that son or daughter of this or that person, to exchange money and services. Thus in every conventional prospect, one uses identity.
I admire Ramana Maharshi and Sri Nisargadatta. I met both on the astral planes. Once I was in a place created in the astral world by Nisargadatta where he has an ashram for his disciples. This means to me that there is identity beyond the material body which is currently tagged with a specific name and number.
Michael BelovedI see the denial of identity as an effective tactic to fade out the social mock-up identity and its encrusted formulations which for the time being one takes seriously but which in the long term will be wiped out no matter how much one clings to it. But still there will remain an invisible indelible person self (purusha) which transcends these designations which we find to be necessary in the physical and astral realities.
Gordon Paterson Why, Michael, is there such revulsion on the prospects of re-birth, when previous lives, as a reality, is questionable and improbable?
Why should one who is leading a compassionate life be concerned with the prospects of a future one? Who is there really to care? Shanti. Nirguna
Jeff Cannon To be right minded and right-action oriented solely based on the prospect of not having to return to the human experience seems counter-intuitive to the whole idea of samsara. If you are seeking a return on your investment of doing good, then you may be missing the entire point of doing good for the sake of simply being a better person, a better spirit and adding to the positive nature of existence.
Michael Beloved Jeff, sure one is better off not aspiring for returns but that does nothing to deal with nature's way of rendering returns. It is not all up to the individual. If I shoot someone and he forgives me, I may still be faced by charges from the government. Both factors need be taken into account. The return from the courts will come even if the victim forgives and forgets. How to deal with that.
Michael Beloved Gordon, I agree that once one denies his and everyone's individuality, there is no conversation. But here individuality is not denied but is recognized, as per Bhagavad Gita, where Krishna affirms that once it comes into existence it remains perpetual.
Gordon Paterson Yes, of course, Michael, I will not question the Bhagavad Gita. Yet, the teaching of such masters as Sri Maharshi and Sri Nisargadatta, both Jnanis, instructs that the so-called individual, as an entity, is non-existent.
I'm not asking you to support these teachings, Michael, as you appear to be a profound Yogi, but Truth is singular and not-two and should be the same irrespective of the path leading to It. So the Goal, which is Self-knowledge, should be the same for all.
You are admired by This, Michael. Namaskaram. Nirguna
Michael Beloved Gordon,
The social self is definitely ephemeral even though functionally we must all pretend that it is real. Even to use the internet to communicate, one has to posture an identity to establish an account. To even eat one has to use some identity as this or that son or daughter of this or that person, to exchange money and services. Thus in every conventional prospect, one uses identity.
I admire Ramana Maharshi and Sri Nisargadatta. I met both on the astral planes. Once I was in a place created in the astral world by Nisargadatta where he has an ashram for his disciples. This means to me that there is identity beyond the material body which is currently tagged with a specific name and number.
Michael Beloved I see the denial of identity as an effective tactic to fade out the social mock-up identity and its encrusted formulations which for the time being one takes seriously but which in the long term will be wiped out no matter how much one clings to it. But still there will remain an invisible indelible person self (purusha) which transcends these designations which we find to be necessary in the physical and astral realities.