Continued from above…

unlimitedsun 5 years ago

Certainly! Anyone may add to their heart’s content.

Alfredo wrote:

Sri Aurobindo defined the soul of man in a masterful way as the Psychic Being. This, in my opinion, is Michael's Core-Self.

unlimitedsun's reply:

If I may speculate: The core-self and the psychic may be even further distinguished. The psychic being may be more akin to the subtle body's, storage of emotions, impressions, proclivities...elements which the core-self would require its usual apparatus to access, they are otherwise distinct from it.

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Alfredo wrote:

So, this is the entity that reincarnates, it is our individuality, it goes with us, and every time a new entity is formed, it takes from the Pranic (vital), from the mental (mind), and from the physical (material) and forms the new entity around it, including a subtle body.

unlimitedsun's reply:

Typically the subtle body itself, vastly impregnated with the agenda of the life-force is more so involved in the technicality of reincarnation than the core-self. But I guess Sri Aurobindo's approach is even more different.

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Alfredo wrote:

Now, this psychic being is not the Atma, be careful, but of the same substance.

unlimitedsun's reply:

If the core-self is accepted as the psychic being, then it may be of a different substance than the atma. Well, then it is a question of definition.

I can see the difficulty in amalgamating different approaches.

Alfredo 5 years ago

Surya Ji!

Thanks for your thoughtful answer.

unlimitedsun wrote:

[If I may speculate: The core-self and the psychic may be even further distinguished. The psychic being may be more akin to the subtle body's, storage of emotions, impressions, proclivities...elements which the core-self would require its usual apparatus to access, they are otherwise distinct from it.]

Alfredo's reply:

The Psychic Being of Sri Aurobindo is of the same essence as the Atma, just a portion of it that carries our individuality as humans...I have a question for you? Who/what supports the subtle body? Does the subtle body exists by itself? How does it manifest? What props it up? All the storages you speak of are not carried by the subtle body, but the subtle body is a manifestation of them. Do you think the subtle body is an individual entity that stays in the "astral" waiting to reincarnate? No. It is a continuous manifestation of the Psychic Being, now temporarily in the astral, now temporarily in the material manifestation. Sometimes in both, and then some. Although shrouded in ignorance, the essence of the Psychic Being is effulgence, perfection, continuity, eternity.

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unlimitedsun wrote:

[Typically the subtle body itself, vastly impregnated with the agenda of the life-force is more so involved in the technicality of reincarnation than the core-self. But I guess Sri Aurobindo's approach is even more different.]

Alfredo's reply:

The subtle body dances to the life force, yes. If he is involved in the technicalities of reincarnation it is only because it can do so due to the Psychic Being. Alas, there is no subtle body without it!

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unlimitedsun wrote:

If the core-self is accepted as the psychic being, then it may be of a different substance than the atma. Well, then it is a question of definition.

I can see the difficulty in amalgamating different approaches.

Alfredo's reply:

Perhaps Acharyaji can help us. If Acharyaji defines the core-self as an individuality devoid of divine essence, I will agree with you so far, but if Acharyaji ascribes to the core-self the essences I am speaking of above, then no.

A hint may be found in "Anu Gita Explained", page 236:

"In the conditioned stage the core-self misidentifies itself as its adjuncts. It feels it is the psyche; that it is the mind; that it is the emotions; that it is the urges; that it is the reasoning and memories...".

So...what is then the causal body? What is the relationship of the causal body to the core-self? If there isn't any, then the core-self would remain in the psyche of man. But there is.

unlimitedsun 5 years ago

This is great! It feels like a discourse in one of those Tibetan monasteries. You know, they repeatedly clap their hands, and take turns; enlivening!

So I go “clap!” followed by hand rolling motion.

BTW any one knows what is the purpose of that distinguished part of the Tibetan monastic discourse system? And so curiosity killed the cat.:)

Alfredo wrote:

Do you think the subtle body is an individual entity that stays in the "astral" waiting to reincarnate? No. It is a continuous manifestation of the Psychic Being, now temporarily in the astral, now temporarily in the material manifestation. Sometimes in both, and then some. Although shrouded in ignorance, the essence of the Psychic Being is effulgence, perfection, continuity, eternity.

unlimitedsun's reply:

That is the according to the interpretation of Sri Aurobindo. In my understanding so far the subtle body is not a manifestation or (perhaps an extension?) of the soul/atma. The subtle body, as well as the life force is adopted by the soul/atma so that it may experience itself. It did not originate with them, it did not produce them.

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Alfredo wrote:

The subtle body dances to the life force, yes. If he is involved in the technicalities of reincarnation it is only because it can do so due to the Psychic Being. Alas, there is no subtle body without it!

unlimitedsun's reply:

In my understanding all the components of the subtle body exist independently from the soul/atma and will continue to exist after it detaches from it/them. Just like the physical body disintegrates in its original components to be taken on by another.

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Alfredo wrote:

A hint may be found in "Anu Gita Explained", page 236:

"In the conditioned stage the core-self misidentifies itself as its adjuncts. It feels it is the psyche; that it is the mind; that it is the emotions; that it is the urges; that it is the reasoning and memories...".

unlimitedsun's reply:

So as in the case of any misidentification, it is best to leave it alone and move on (as we want to); unless if the misidentification is considered a manifestation from the original source, (here the subtle body to the psychic-being). Then we would be in a pickle!

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Alfredo wrote:

So...what is then the causal body? What is the relationship of the causal body to the core-self? If there isn't any, then the core-self would remain in the psyche of man. But there is.

unlimitedsun's reply:

The causal body I would say is closer to the soul in characteristic and not necessarily in terms of nature and substance. So that, the causal body would be comparable to Sri Aurobindo’s psychic being and not the core-self. The core-self would be in my opinion more akin to what Sri Aurobindo labeled the central being;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Integral_psychology_(Sri_Aurobindo)

((Central Being is a technical term used by Sri Aurobindo to designate the transcendent and eternal spirit, as opposed to the incarnate and evolving Soul, which he calls the Psychic Being))

Found in Letters on Yoga vol.I under "Planes and Parts of Being" (pp. 265ff in the 3rd ed.)

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Alfredo wrote:

Now, this psychic being is not the Atma, be careful, but of the same substance.

unlimitedsun's reply:

In essence, like the endoplasm wraps around the nucleus (for the membrane) so does the causal body, the core-self and the psychic-being, the core-self. However, the causal body and the psychic-being appear very distinct in characteristics.