varun ahlawatin chapter 2 .11 as said by Michael Beloved above ---- the correct words are Thou hast grieved for those that should not be grieved for, yet thou speakest words of wisdom. The wise grieve neither for the living nor for the dead.
now where it is use as souls , people did interpretation their own , ask any sanskrit teacher about the word soul here -2.11
जिन के लिये शोक नहीं करना चाहिये उनके लिये तुम शोक कर रहे हो और बोल तुम बुद्धीमानों की तरहँ रहे हो। ज्ञानी लोग न उन के लिये शोक करते है जो चले गऐ और न उन के लिये जो हैं॥
varun ahlawatnow finally - न त्वेवाहं जातु नासं न त्वं नेमे जनाधिपाः। न चैव न भविष्यामः सर्वे वयमतः परम्॥२- १२॥
न तुम्हारा न मेरा और न ही यह राजा जो दिख रहे हैं इनका कभी नाश होता है॥ और यह भी नहीं की हम भविष्य मे नहीं रहेंगे॥
देहिनोऽस्मिन्यथा देहे कौमारं यौवनं जरा। तथा देहान्तरप्राप्तिर्धीरस्तत्र न मुह्यति॥२- १३॥
आत्मा जैसे देह के बाल, युवा यां बूढे होने पर भी वैसी ही रहती है उसी प्रकार देह का अन्त होने पर भी वैसी ही रहती है॥बुद्धीमान लोग इस पर
व्यथित नहीं होते॥
varun ahlawat2.20 He is not born nor does He ever die; after having been, He again ceases not to be. Unborn, eternal, changeless and ancient, He is not killed when the body is killed, Vedaavinaashinam nityam ya enam ajam avyayam; Katham sa purushah paartha kam ghaatayati hanti kam
Michael Belovedvarun ahlawat, Several Sanskrit terms are used but the context is the persons whom Arjuna expressed grief about. Those persons were on the battlefield physically. Krishna begins by using dehinam for the term. See my translation attached of the first place where Krishna indicated that. I am not attached to the word soul and I hardly used that in my translation. One of your hang-ups is that you are quick to jump the gun as soon as you see an English word because you are one of those persons who feel that English is not sufficient for Sanskrit equivalents but I did not find that to be true in translating several Sanskrit works. The reason is simple. If the English speaking population has experienced what a Sanskrit terms describes then the English language can express the subject of concern. But if someone in India is unaware of the meanings (not common meaning in India) of English words, then that person will feel that English is insufficient.
Michael BelovedFor instance let us consider the word brahman which is central to the Upanishads. Whatever that is, whatever that experience is, the rishis address it by that term. Now if someone proves that such experience cannot be had by any of the English speaking peoples, then I will agree that no English man can describe that term in his language. But if it is a fact that some English person can experience that, then those people may have a word for it and that qualifies them to use their term. You for example speak negatively of the word concentration as any part of meditation, but I doubt if you have got a large English dictionary and have carefully checked on the many meanings of that word and found that every meaning is irrelevant. English in my view is quite fit to deal with Sanskrit and I say this after translating several books: Bhagavad Gita Anu Gita Uddhava Gita Hatha Yoga Pradipika Markandeya Samasya Yoga Sutras
Michael BelovedAnd these are not just translations but translations based on over 40 years of ashtanga yoga practice in this body with lives times of yoga practice in India prior. Here I give the first reference to whatever you choose to call soul. I am not attached to the word soul. We can use any word, even apple or star, provided we agree to call what Krishna spoke of in relation to what Arjuna lamented about killing. I can talk to you sensibly if you stick with the context but if you run off to use the terms with some other information, I will not follow your conversation because to me that is distortion.
Michael BelovedGita verses which began the use of terms for what Arjuna lamented about: na tvevāhaṁ jātu nāsaṁ na tvaṁ neme janādhipāḥ na caiva na bhaviṣyāmaḥ sarve vayamataḥ param (2.12) na — no; tv (tu) — in fact; eva — alone; aham — I; jātu — ever; na — not; āsam — I did exist; na — nor; tvaṁ — you; neme = na — nor + ime — these; jana-adhipāḥ — rulers of the people; na — not; caiva — and indeed; na — nor; bhaviṣyāmaḥ — we will exist; sarve — all; vayam — we; ataḥ - from now; param — onwards There was never a time when I did not exist, nor you nor these rulers of the people. Nor will we cease to exist from now onwards. (2.12) dehino'sminyathā dehe kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā tathā dehāntaraprāptir dhīrastatra na muhyati (2.13)
Michael Beloveddehinaḥ — of the embodied soul; asmin — in this; yathā — as; dehe — in the body; kaumāraṁ — in childhood; yauvanam — in youth; jarā — in old age; tathā — so in sequence; deha — body; antara — another; prāptiḥ — acquirement; dhīraḥ — wise person; tatra — on this topic; na — not; muhyati — is confused
As the embodied soul endures childhood, youth and old age, so another body is acquired in sequence. The wise person is not confused on this topic. (2.13)
Michael BelovedKrishna begins about the physical body and what inhabits that physical body which will be displaced if that body is killed. If you wish to terms that as rabbit, then we can continue with an agreement that soul is the wrong term and rabbit is the connect nomenclature.
Martin GustavssonThe non-action in meditation is also creating karma. It must be compared to the good action that is lost whilst meditating. On the other hand is action before a proper level of enlightenment through meditation almost a guarantee of ineffectivness. Also Buddha acted, even if he finally did give politics up. I am not quite sure he did the right thing, but without his choice my life would probably not be as courageus and happy as it is, but who knows, maybe he then would have been replaced by another monk as the figurehead. Anyway, my heart forbids me to quit with political action for the benefit of nature and future generations. I hope you one day find your hearts and enlightened minds in meditation and decide to join me.
varun ahlawat in chapter 2 .11 as said by Michael Beloved above ---- the correct words are Thou hast grieved for those that should not be grieved for, yet thou speakest words of wisdom. The wise grieve neither for the living nor for the dead.
now where it is use as souls , people did interpretation their own , ask any sanskrit teacher about the word soul here -2.11
hindi / sanskrit
अशोच्यानन्वशोचस्त्वं प्रज्ञावादांश्च भाषसे।
गतासूनगतासूंश्च नानुशोचन्ति पण्डिताः॥२- ११॥
जिन के लिये शोक नहीं करना चाहिये उनके लिये तुम शोक कर रहे
हो और बोल तुम बुद्धीमानों की तरहँ रहे हो। ज्ञानी लोग न उन के लिये शोक करते है
जो चले गऐ और न उन के लिये जो हैं॥
varun ahlawat now finally -
न त्वेवाहं जातु नासं न त्वं नेमे जनाधिपाः।
न चैव न भविष्यामः सर्वे वयमतः परम्॥२- १२॥
न तुम्हारा न मेरा और न ही यह राजा जो दिख रहे हैं इनका कभी नाश होता है॥
और यह भी नहीं की हम भविष्य मे नहीं रहेंगे॥
देहिनोऽस्मिन्यथा देहे कौमारं यौवनं जरा।
तथा देहान्तरप्राप्तिर्धीरस्तत्र न मुह्यति॥२- १३॥
आत्मा जैसे देह के बाल, युवा यां बूढे होने पर भी वैसी ही रहती है
उसी प्रकार देह का अन्त होने पर भी वैसी ही रहती है॥बुद्धीमान लोग इस पर
व्यथित नहीं होते॥
varun ahlawat 2.20
He is not born nor does He ever die; after having been, He again ceases not to be. Unborn, eternal, changeless and ancient, He is not killed when the body is killed,
Vedaavinaashinam nityam ya enam ajam avyayam;
Katham sa purushah paartha kam ghaatayati hanti kam
varun ahlawat Raj Kumar Dham sir that which is changless cannot be souls . it is not two .
om namaha shivaya
Michael Beloved varun ahlawat, Several Sanskrit terms are used but the context is the persons whom Arjuna expressed grief about. Those persons were on the battlefield physically. Krishna begins by using dehinam for the term. See my translation attached of the first place where Krishna indicated that. I am not attached to the word soul and I hardly used that in my translation. One of your hang-ups is that you are quick to jump the gun as soon as you see an English word because you are one of those persons who feel that English is not sufficient for Sanskrit equivalents but I did not find that to be true in translating several Sanskrit works. The reason is simple. If the English speaking population has experienced what a Sanskrit terms describes then the English language can express the subject of concern. But if someone in India is unaware of the meanings (not common meaning in India) of English words, then that person will feel that English is insufficient.
Michael Beloved For instance let us consider the word brahman which is central to the Upanishads. Whatever that is, whatever that experience is, the rishis address it by that term. Now if someone proves that such experience cannot be had by any of the English speaking peoples, then I will agree that no English man can describe that term in his language. But if it is a fact that some English person can experience that, then those people may have a word for it and that qualifies them to use their term.
You for example speak negatively of the word concentration as any part of meditation, but I doubt if you have got a large English dictionary and have carefully checked on the many meanings of that word and found that every meaning is irrelevant. English in my view is quite fit to deal with Sanskrit and I say this after translating several books:
Bhagavad Gita
Anu Gita
Uddhava Gita
Hatha Yoga Pradipika
Markandeya Samasya
Yoga Sutras
Michael Beloved And these are not just translations but translations based on over 40 years of ashtanga yoga practice in this body with lives times of yoga practice in India prior.
Here I give the first reference to whatever you choose to call soul. I am not attached to the word soul. We can use any word, even apple or star, provided we agree to call what Krishna spoke of in relation to what Arjuna lamented about killing. I can talk to you sensibly if you stick with the context but if you run off to use the terms with some other information, I will not follow your conversation because to me that is distortion.
Michael Beloved Gita verses which began the use of terms for what Arjuna lamented about:
na tvevāhaṁ jātu nāsaṁ
na tvaṁ neme janādhipāḥ
na caiva na bhaviṣyāmaḥ
sarve vayamataḥ param (2.12)
na — no; tv (tu) — in fact; eva — alone; aham — I; jātu — ever; na — not; āsam — I did exist; na — nor; tvaṁ — you; neme = na — nor + ime — these; jana-adhipāḥ — rulers of the people; na — not; caiva — and indeed; na — nor; bhaviṣyāmaḥ — we will exist; sarve — all; vayam — we; ataḥ - from now; param — onwards
There was never a time when I did not exist, nor you nor these rulers of the people. Nor will we cease to exist from now onwards. (2.12)
dehino'sminyathā dehe
kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā
tathā dehāntaraprāptir
dhīrastatra na muhyati (2.13)
Michael Beloved dehinaḥ — of the embodied soul; asmin — in this; yathā — as; dehe — in the body; kaumāraṁ — in childhood; yauvanam — in youth; jarā — in old age; tathā — so in sequence; deha — body; antara — another; prāptiḥ — acquirement; dhīraḥ — wise person; tatra — on this topic; na — not; muhyati — is confused
As the embodied soul endures childhood, youth and old age, so another body is acquired in sequence. The wise person is not confused on this topic. (2.13)
Michael Beloved Krishna begins about the physical body and what inhabits that physical body which will be displaced if that body is killed. If you wish to terms that as rabbit, then we can continue with an agreement that soul is the wrong term and rabbit is the connect nomenclature.
Martin Gustavsson The non-action in meditation is also creating karma. It must be compared to the good action that is lost whilst meditating. On the other hand is action before a proper level of enlightenment through meditation almost a guarantee of ineffectivness. Also Buddha acted, even if he finally did give politics up. I am not quite sure he did the right thing, but without his choice my life would probably not be as courageus and happy as it is, but who knows, maybe he then would have been replaced by another monk as the figurehead. Anyway, my heart forbids me to quit with political action for the benefit of nature and future generations. I hope you one day find your hearts and enlightened minds in meditation and decide to join me.