Fall From Heaven
Meditationtime Forum Post
Date: Posted 3 years before Oct 26, 2016
MiBeloved 3 years ago
When there is a fall from heaven, is it based primarily of the person being evacuated from heaven, or on the person being attracted to the lower domain?
There is a popular story from the Puranas, about King Yayati’s fall.* It seems that the supernatural being who supervised passage and stay in the heavenly world, Swarga loka, had dismissed Yayati from heaven after setting a trap for the pious king where the king would boast about the austerities performed in the most recent earthly life.
Is it that a person who is elevated to a heavenly world, on the basis of socially beneficial acts on earth, becomes attracted to the earth for the very reason of its facility for competition, something which one cannot exploit in the heavenly domain?
Will a human being who is elevated to a heavenly world, feel that something is missing in that celestial place, if it does not have facility for excelling and surpassing the performance of others?
After going to heaven for being a good guy, and taking the Yayati’s story at face value, not doubting it, then what will be my lot, how long will I be able to stay in heaven if there is no allowance for me to live in a way where I can be outstanding and excel others?
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For Yayati’s fall see this page:
http://jayarama.wordpress.com/2011/03/29/yayati-falls-down-from-heaven/
Jettins 3 years ago
Michael wrote:
Will a human being who is elevated to a heavenly world, feel that something is missing in that celestial place, if it does not have facility for excelling and surpassing the performance of others?
Jettins’ Reply:
I don't think competition is the main cause that brings people down from "heaven", it's boredom.
How long existentially speaking does a person want to experience being a yogi?
MiBeloved 3 years ago
Firas Swidan wrote:
Is it possible to fall from heaven? Does one actually leave heaven, or is it always with one. It is simply up to us to decide if we want to see heaven or not.
Michael Beloved wrote:
Really Firas, it is up to us?
Was it up to us that we were born?
The story of Yayati is being taken as it is, as an actual astral occurrence.
Being in a war zone and having a conflict in one's mind are two very different realities. It is not just about what is in a person's mind because in the mind or not in the mind, there are environments which can be pleasant or unpleasant irrespective of the mental condition of persons in those locales.
Can a prisoner be happy in jail?
Sure but what has that got to do with the fact that he is restricted and cannot go here and there as he pleases.
Firas Swidan wrote:
Is it up to aliens then? In unity and wholeness, who else is there beyond us?
Michael Beloved wrote:
Good question, Firas!
Firas Swidan wrote:
I am curious about your opinion Michael.
Sunil Mark-Singh wrote:
Is heaven a spiritual term or is heaven just used a religious term? I get mixed up a lot because I am quite new to this.
@Michael - are you spiritual/religious or both?!
Michael Beloved wrote:
Firas,
I have visited both hellish and heavenly worlds on the astral levels of existence. These are environments, just as the material world we behold is an environment. And as one can lose one's footing here, or at least it is lost when the physical body is no longer available, so one can lose perception of a particular astral place.
As by criminal and other anti-social acts, one can be deprived of the rights of a citizen, so in the astral dimension there are conditions and behaviors which may cause someone to be exited from a heavenly place.
As when one goes to a foreign country, one stay there is regulated by visa permissions, so in some astral places, one's stay there is related to one's cultivated piety in the former earthly existence.
As criminal activity in this world may cause someone to be incarcerated for a limited time, so certain antisocial acts during the earthly life in a physical body, may cause an individual spirit to be restricted to a hellish world for a certain duration only.
Firas Swidan wrote:
If I understand your argument correctly Michael, you say in principal there is no difference between what is happening in the physical world and in the astral world? It is the same rules, the same corruptions, the same jails, lawyers and courts?
If so, perhaps it is the same object, the same world, observed from two different perspectives?
Michael Beloved wrote:
My main statement is that there are two principals, if we may lay it out like that, which is that there is the psychological environment, which I feel you are stressing, and there is the nature environment or astral nature environment. These run parallel to each other and one has some feedback with the other.
The psychological environment is more under the control of the individual concerned, you or me, while the nature environment is a larger order and is not necessarily responsive in every case to the individual concerned.
The hell which is the mental and emotional condition of the individual is one type of reality, and the hell of the nature environment is another type of reality in which the individual has less control.
My view, and I give it on a take it or leave it basis, is that it is misleading to indicate that all that matters is the psychological environment. That is just not true. Only when the nature environment affords the individual its favorable response and its openness (opportunity), does the individual's psychological state under the control of the said person. Otherwise all good plans of mice and men go terribly wrong.
